Your Online Counselor Forum

Welcome again! If you are an adult child of a narcissistic parent you might be interested in reading my latest article on the role of the other parent in your life. It's quite common for children of narcissists to idolize their other parent, and this is natural since the child needs to feel that they are loved by someone. During therpay, accepting the role that the non-NPD parent played in our upbringing can be very difficult,yet it is necessarly for full freedom from this distressing situation. Anyway, have a read and let's hear your feedback! You can find the article here http://mental-health.families.com/blog/ ... narcissist

Best wishes,
Beth

I am ambivalent about my father. Sometimes years ago, if he dared, he supported us children, other times he was as cold as Mum. Now they are in their 80s I feel desperaty sorry for him locked in the loungeroom with my NPD mum, a crazy cat she dotes on and a large tray of kitty litter. She tells him when to eat, when to take his meds, what to watch on TV when and what he thinks of what he sees on TV and how long he can talk to us children on the phone. They live many miles away (of course!)which is good for us but bad for him. He has finally realised how much we mean to him and that Mum would happily let him be buried a thousand miles from us and then leave his grave there. We think she will attach herself to the sisier she has been jealous of for years and hardly talks to but who is the only person left she can latch on to. However, he seems unable to move even though we have begged him to move closer to us all. He says it is up to her. So, even until someoen's death, the NPD will play out their game. Feelings, decency, reality - it all means nothing to the NPD.

Hi Holly,
Your last comment is so spot on. YOu can try persuading your dad to move but it will be unlikely to have the results you want. At least in doing so you can at least draw comfort in the fact that you tried to save your father. But ultimately it is his responsibility to save himself, and at hs age, realistically it is unlikely that he would change or even could change. The best you can do is love him from a distance and communicate as often as you can and try to make his older years as happy as you can. However take care not to get yourself embroiled in any 3-way relationship between him, yourself and your mother, because this is where she will not only win but will cause further pain in your family unit. NPD is a sad situation especially when one parent is caught in the web but if you read my article on Fathers and their role when the mother is a narcissist, you will see that they too, must take responsibility for the role they played as adults in the family they helped to create. Good luck Holly, set clear boundaries and if you need further help you can always contact me.
Best wishes,

Beth

I thought that I was the only child alive who had daydreams about courtroom dramas in which my father finally divorced my mother and I, on the witness stand, pointed to my father - "I choose you!" Divorce fantasies - how nuts, right?
After suffering 35 years of emotional abuse and control by my puppetmaster of a mother, I feel freed when I read these articles and posts. I went to therapy in my first year of marriage because I had thought that getting married (read: getting out of my parents' home) would equal happiness - surprise, depression ensued. I am lucky that I had the good sense to marry a man who is emotionally available and sympathetic - he is very supportive. Anyway, my therapist diagnosed me as a child with a parent with narcissistic personality disorder - no need to rehash all the gory details here - but a highlight is my mother's suicide attempt (od'ing on tylenol) which she subsequently blamed on me (a 9 year old) and then refused to allow me in the room where she was hospitalized (my two younger sisters were allowed in).
My father and I have only spoken candidly about any of this once - I have always idolized him unttil going through therapy - he told me at least I would "escape" when I got married. Other than that one conversation, we all pretend that our family is typical - no, better than typical.
I find myself going back and forth between being OK and seeing my mother for what she is - someone who isn't really capable of loving me who only wants control - and letting her comments and actions bother me to the point of distraction.
My therapy experience was ten years ago, and I am now the proud mother of two beautiful daughters. I am now in the ambivalent situation trying to understand what kind of access my mother should/should not have to my children. My father has told me that he thinks she is great with the girls, and based upon my observations, nothing alarming has occurred.
I guess I am wondering what others think about allowing my parents to have access to my own children. I don't want to deprive my children, but I don't want to expose them to what I went though, either. I would appreciate any feedback - and thank you, Beth, for providing this place for us!

Hi Amy, it is a difficult choice regarding your mother and your children, particularly when you have experienced first hand the problems that narcissism causes. The one benfit your children have -- and it is a huge benfit -- it that they are buffeted by the sheer presence of you and your husband. In their formative years, you two are their role models and protectors. They are not subjected to your mother on a first hand basis and if she does do or say inappropriate things, you are there to protect them and also to explain to your children at an apropriate age what is wrong with grandma.

Try not to worry too much about this. The sad part is that your children will never know the joys of a loving grandparent.

Best,
Beth

Hi Amy:
I know I'm getting to this a little bit late (6 mos.) but I'm a newbie here. I didn't realize that my Dad had NPD until well after my kids had been exposed to him (2 boys, now 20 & 18). One day, my eldest son blew me out of the water with this comment: "I think Grandpa Tom doesn't tell the truth. I think he just always wants to be the best." My response was to agree and say "Yep, that's exactly the way Grandpa is."

My point is this: If you are present in your kid's lives and you have provided a safe and reliable family life, they'll spot the NPD Grandparent even before you do. Your loving and honest presence will be enough for them. They will not "need" anything from NPD Grandparents, other than a visit and some shared time. Be prepared though, as they age, and as they witness the NPD behavior toward you, they may elect not to spend much time with their Grandparent(s). My sons have taken that route.

I wish you the best in your journey - keep your chin up.
Cheech

Thanks Cheech for your input.
The effect of an NPD grandparent cannot have the same impact as that of an NPD parent. Part of the fear that is driving the fear of a grandparent's influence is that of the painful childhood that the adult child of a narcissist has experienced. This fear permeates and contaminates the feelings of the adult child but, unless the grandchildren are living with their grandparents or the NPD g'parent is particularly obnoxious, then there is no great cause for concern. It is important though, for the in-law parent to recognise that there is a problem present otherwise their can be marital problems.

Best,
Beth

Beth,
In a couple, if one is a narcissist, doesn't the other become an enabler? Like my sister's hubby is a N. My sister became the enabler and had personality like a narcissist too.

I am trying to understand the dynamics of their relationship.

Eve

Hi Eve,
If one partner in a relationship is a narcissist then, yes, the other has to adapt/accept this behavior and therefore has one of two choices: toe the line and follow intructions or argue and perhpas ultimatley leave. The other option is that the second partner becomes a psuedo narcissist and seems to act like the primary narcissist but this is a survival tool that thy use in order to curry the favor of the narcissisitic partner.

Hope this helps! It is a confusing disorder at first put the pattern is consistent when you know what to look for.

Best,
Beth

Hi Beth. Just wondering if a pseudo N can be "fixed" or "cured" unlike a real true N? If they are exhibiting the exact same behaviors as their N partner, does that mean that on the inside they also think they are perfect and the world around them is wrong? Do they have typically have some other personality disorder that makes them more susceptible to taking on the N traits? That's an interesting situation. I can tell you that my mother since being around her truly N mother more after my dad died is becoming more and more nasty like her mom and it definitely seems she is highly gratified by thinking she is doing her mommy proud. I don't know if that is the same thing or not. She's always been emotionally way under developed and not able to empathize w/ others, but she really was much more passive back in the day so it wasn't as obvious or offensive. Still manipulative but in a softer manner. Now she's just out of control nasty. It seems very much like she is putting on a show for others, kind of how a kid acts tougher than they are, to impress others if that makes sense. I wrote a few days ago about her showing up to my house out of the blue. On the phone, at first, she acted like nothing in the world was wrong (as though I would be happy she was here) and as though she thought she was being cute by just showing up. And it seemed like she thought she had crafted her, what felt like an ambush, so well that there was no way that I could have rejected her. Though she must have suspected that I was going to because she immediately, after the first sentence flipped the switch from "cutesie" to being really nasty and preachy. I have to say, as much as I have read on the topic of boundaries and going NC, I don't feel I was particularly prepared for her visit. She basically made a stormy exit (as stormy as it could be over the phone) and then the next week (my bday was the next week) sent me a bday card saying something to the effect that I will always be in her heart even if I don't need or want her in my life. It was like she was tying the event up in a neat package to file away in her mind...even though I know she is impulsive and will send or do something else probably down the road when the mood strikes. She really never has stuck to anything at all that she has said...even when she has had me utterly convinced of her conviction...she always changes her story down the line sometimes the very next day. At any rate, I was thinking following this visit of saying if she gets professional counseling, that maybe we could have a relationship down the road depending upon how that goes. However, I know she thinks that I am the one who needs it (maybe I do!! lol!!)...I would be willing to do it if she would actually buy into it w/ sincerity. I don't think there is a person on the planet that could convince her that she is in any way in the wrong though. She would walk away from it saying the therapist was crazy, not her. Anyway, it's on my mind a lot more lately. I think mostly because the wound is being re-opened from what I know will be her further trashing my name to her friends and family. It's just not fun to feel "talked about" in a negative way. And I think it hurts and angers me the most the way she and her mom are trashing my dad. There were literally hundreds of people at my dad's wake. People he had not seen in years and they all came through the line and said what a wonderful man he was (he was shirt off his back kind of guy and also a fun person to be around...he really didn't want to leave a conversation until he had made the other person at least smile...but a guttural laugh would be best). I know that's what is expected at a funeral/wake, but they had sincerity in their eyes, it didn't seem obligatory at all. Conversely, there was hardly anyone at my maternal grandfather's funeral. Now, he was older so many of his friends may have already passed. But it was just a cold, going through the motions, type of scene and the sermon was about how much money he gave in tithes. But yet, my mom and her mom still contend that their way is the right way, and my dad was an idiot. All of those people were fooled by him somehow. I just hate that they are in a small town tarnishing his name. I think that's what's really bothering me the most right now.